Agilo velomobile

[anotherkiwi]

Just back from a very unfit 26 km... I forgot the Ventoline... How unfit? A full +1 Wh/km from the battery despite the modifications below. I have not ridden a velocipede with a 56T chainring since I was in my 20's The cranks are 165 mm and the Rohloff sprocket the stock 16T so you have all the significant numbers.

Gocycle tyres: near silent, very comfortable, I tested at 3.5 bar. One could imagine they have less rolling resistance than the Maxxis DTH but my physical condition is not one on which I would base such a hypothesis...

Rohloff: gear spacing now that is what I was talking about! You are always in the correct gear so my cadence was always 80-90 rpm. Despite pulling more Wh from the battery the motor was hardly warm to the touch thanks to that correct gear for the moment. Climbed all the hills, slowly but at cadence - today 81-82 rpm. I may come to enjoy the twist shifter, at the top of a rise you can think ahead and grab 3 or 4 gears instead of 1 or 2 with a click shifter.

Hast du einige Bilder vom den Lademöglichkeiten der Packfächer?

https://www.velomobilforum.de/forum/index.php?threads/agilo-velomobile.58946/post-1278785 gives you a good idea of the holes I cut - they are not the ones on the plan. I only have access from the inside to the top compartment, on the plan you can open the lid. The holes in the side of the seat were cut to accept a 3 litre bag-in-box of red wine... Six-packs of 33 cl cans of beer also fit I put covers on mine so that I can pull my shoulders back and rest my elbows there. A 147 cm fishing rod fits in the left side, a bit acrobatic to get it around the tiller but it works.

The top hole has a strip of carbon fibre around the top just in case I removed too much strength and a strip of wood to make it thicker at the bottom. When I go to do my DIY tasks at my girlfriend's house I put my drill and sander plus other tools in there. My fishing back pack goes there with the wheels for the boat beach trailer. Etc.

In the end I still prefer to tow a trailer with fishing and boating stuff, that is why I mounted a 42T chainring as a granny and towing gear.

 

[Windjaeger]

Das nenne ich einen alltagstauglichen Lastesel mit gelegentlichen Ambitionen

 

[anotherkiwi]

OK, Agilo gearing one more time. Agilo is designed around a single gear chainline and requires a hub gear. This is a bit long and destined primarily for those who are building or about to build as a guide, everyone has different goals and physical capacities...

When used here, for going fishing and driving around town, shopping etc. - 10 to 20 km trips - the Alfine 8 was sufficient with pedelec support. If my apartment was anywhere in town except here... So I used 2 x chainrings (52-42) to solve that problem.

Going to the next town, again where I live, requires more gear range with 1 x chainring so an Alfine 11 gearbox would bring those extra gears for a 30 km trip. It also provides closer gear spacing, above 30 km/h and on the flat that is very useful. An Alfine 11 with 2 x chainrings would be perfectly acceptable gearing for longer range driving in the more hilly places. In flat places a strong driver will not need a motor to drive in the countryside. Driving through larger cities will be much more comfortable with pedelec support.

I was smiled upon from above and offered the chance to equip my Agilo with a Rohloff. I took that opportunity so now I have a high end gearbox just like the Orca does . Considered the best IGH it is not without its quirks however. It is very noisy and people tell me it will be very noisy for at least 1000 km . It doesn't offer the choice of click or twist shifter as the Shimano IGHs do as standard. The external cable box was a bit of a surprise to be honest, I can understand wanting to standardise on screw sizes but the Torx 20 is way to big there and that tiny sliver of aluminium is not an example of good design in my opinion. And 65€ (discount price) for a chain tensioner! Seriously?

Fitting:
- 2 cables instead of one to pass through places that are hard to reach, and twice the weight
- I did not cut the cable outer and cut 10 mm off one of the gear cables so it fits, just. The Shimano cable was much longer and both outer and inner cable needed shortening.
- the cable fitment in the twist shifter is a bit of a pain when you are installing alone, it could be seated a little more firmly/positively so that you don't have to go back and forth to re-seat when connecting the cables at the rear.
- getting all 14 gears to shift is a bit of a mission because of point 2
- the quick release skewer and the removable cable box are a much better system than the Shimino hubs
- the hub requires a more complex torque arm solution than the Shimano. My hub is the simplest to mount because I have a Rohloff OEM style dropout.

So a short 26 km test and the result is extremely positive because of 1 thing; maintaining correct cadence the whole time. That is possible thanks to the 14% gear spacing so I think that an Alfine 11 hub could have given the same result, always at the same cadence and always in the correct gear. Because of loss of fitness I am about 7-10 rpm off my usual cadence but I have absolutely no pain in my legs this morning. Last time I was unfit like this I hobbled around for 2 days after the same 26 km drive...

That means when the fog lifts (and the battery finishes charging...) I will be back on the road!

What would a post be without some numbers? Rohloff 16T rear sprocket and Alfines 18T rear sprocket, cadence is 88. The Gocycle is of course 50-406 but because I measured the tyre on the rim and entered 1615 mm, the calculator shows a 37-451 wheel. I use ratios to compare, a ratio of 1.3 is about a high as I can go to climb up to the farm with maximum assist so the Alfine 11 with the stock 44T Bafang chainring will manage with a lot of driver input, 53/39 would be a good 2 x choice. I stop pedaling at 45-47 km/h and let gravity do the work from there.

In direct gear I can push 30 flat km/h unfit, both in the Rohloff 11th and the Alfine 8 5th gear (with 52:16T as it was mounted on Agilo)

 

[AusNigeria]

30km/h is more then enough for a bike.

 

[anotherkiwi]

Für mich mit Holz- und Stahlbau-Erfahrung und kleiner Werkstatt am Haus wäre das ein sehr interessantes Projekt. Ich muss auf meinen Alltagsstrecken (gut 8 km pro Richtung zur Arbeitsstelle) auch nicht unbedingt Zeit sparen, aber langsamer als meine derzeitige Reisegeschwindigkeit von 28 bis 32 km/h (Schnitt im Alltagsverkehr 25km/h) will ich natürlich auch nicht werden ...

I just drove through 2 towns to my boat and back 19.78 km in one hour exactly. Maximum gradient climbed about 15%... So stop signs, traffic, a few roundabouts and several hills all with me not at peak fitness level. I think that you could manage 30 km average with 8 vertical metres

 

[Timmi]

Wie funktioniert das eigentlich mit dem Ein- und Aussteigen?
Auf dem You-Tube-Video war auf der Türseite keine Scheibe drin.
Öffnet die Tür mit der Scheibe oder wird die Scheibe erst bei geschlossener Tür eingesetzt?

 

[anotherkiwi]

Bodo Sitko told me I was not elegant... I am not as flexible as I once was! And certainly not as flexible as him or friends of mine who have tried getting in and out. I sit on the seat and then drag my legs in one by one. It doesn't look pretty but it works for me. Out is the same thing but reversed. It looks a lot better when I am wearing SPD-SL shoes because I place my feet on the ground then change shoes before standing up. Standing up you place your right hand on the wheel well the left on the seat back and push if you are old and not flexible.

He didn't like my first version of the DeLorean cutout because the window kind of flopped down when the door was opened so we took it out. The new version stays upright and the 2.5 version will be even better!

As you close the door you grab the top of the window and bring it inside. With the standard windows it works naturally, once the door is closed you slide the rear pane back as far as you need to. I had to do things differently because I am a complicated person The small DeLorean style cutout is open 99% of the time I only close it in very cold wind and heavy rain. I can reach out and set the mirror or show my ID to the police or ...

 

[anotherkiwi]

Added a link to the chain, it now touches both derailleur idlers... Of course a long cage Alivio derailleur is much too long for a 20" wheel but if Tern can do it... And I drive most of the time on the 56T chainring so it is up and out of the way.

Screwed the brake light switch to the tiller, of course a tiny screw broke so I get to remove it and start again

Added the trailer hitch for my 70€ Chinese special trailer

Todo:

- attach headlight better
- cut unused bit off derailleur (it will catch on something someday, we all know that...)
- tidy bodywork and paint

Builders:

The length of the chain tube on the slack side is 130-140 cm
If you have a single chainring you don't need one up front, yes, it will keep your legs clean 60 cm
The rear tube on the drive side can be 70 cm long

 

[anotherkiwi]

Today was the first test drive on a long fast hill. It has a town and a red light at the bottom so I had to brake when the LCD was showing >55 km/h. One thing there is to like about an 80 cm wide track is that even at over 50 km/h in a nice smooth corner with correct camber Agilo handles like it is on rails.

Of course that is not the real speed because my tyres are bigger than the 35-406 that Bafang considers a 20" tyre to be. I did a short segment with the GPS on and the difference in average speed (in town again, once again 19.8 km/h) between the Bafang average and the GPS average was quite large.

I am not going to mount the GPS (Nokia 2.4 in tablet mode) so I will install a speedometer configured with the correct tyre circumference.

Bafang BBS01B and hills... The difference between Agilo and my trike is about 5 km/h on the last hill before home:

- Bafang 15 A x 44v - 11.8 km/h (12.59 km/h corrected)
- Muxus 16 A x 36v - 17.8 km/h

 

[Windjaeger]

One thing there is to like about an 80 cm wide track is that even at over 50 km/h in a nice smooth corner with correct camber Agilo handles like it is on rails.

Super, so soll das sein: a train like a bullet. Was ich beim schnelleren Dahingleiten immer etwas "störend" im VM empfand, war, dass mir der Eindruck der Elemente fehlte, um die Geschwindigkeit auch erfühlen zu können. Wahrscheinlich mochte ich es deswegen immer ohne Haube zu fahren. Ob es das Agilo verträgt das Dach weg zu lassen?

 

[anotherkiwi]

At the moment it is ideal Agilo weather, 5-6º C and dry so the roof is very useful, especially at speed! I asked myself the same question and the internal volume is so comfortable that you don't really mind the roof, it is not claustrophobic inside. The top 10 cm of my windscreen fold down and that is plenty of air to get a notion of speed.

Write to Bodo Sitko, he will show you a cabrio version. The original plan uses the roof as a structural piece so you can't just leave it off without strengthening the body.

 

[Windjaeger]

Ja, ich wollte mich sowieso noch bei Bodo S. melden, um zu erfahren, ob sich meine Schuhe bei Größe 52 frei im Innenraum bewegen können oder ich Anpassarbeiten vornehmen muss. Da werde ich das mit dem Dach gleich mit erledigen.

 

[anotherkiwi]

52!!! My sons have big feet but they stopped at size 49...

In any case you will need seriously short cranks, I drove 170 mm with size 43 shoes (more like 42) and went down to 165 for more comfort but 155 would be even better for larger MTB shoes.

He replied to a mail I sent and the roof has to stay, it is structural.

 

[Windjaeger]

He replied to a mail I sent and the roof has to stay, it is structural.

Ah, gut zu wissen. Danke.

 

[fan-dan]

ich habe einen Cabrio-Plan,

roof has to stay, it is structural

gilt dann, wenn das Agilo eine Tür haben soll. Weiss aber nicht ob die Kiste hölt - ich komm einfach nicht zum bauen ;( In meiner Nullserie-Version ist das Turtle Deck (Hutze) nicht ganz überzeugend, da würde ich drauf sitzen können wollen.

 

[anotherkiwi]

Long time no photo!



@ChristianW here is my brake light switch photo that I promised you, top off, bottom on and parking brake engaged. When I am parked all electricity is switched off because both the headlight and the tail light/brake light are hard wired to the pedelec battery. No artistic bending of the switch lever, it is as it came from the nice Chinese woman's factory. Yes! Better insulation and even smaller crimp on contacts will be fitted soon. And it is very lightweight

And over the last weeks I have had a crash course in chain tension on the pulling side! My 56T chainring required the chain to be a lot slacker and 2 extra chain links brought 4 km/h each to the table. I am now climbing at almost normal speeds with almost normal motor assistance. Having learnt my lesson the hard way I will use a 53T large chainring which should get everything back to normal - I will need to up my cadence on the flat but that should be easy with 3 teeth less at the front This means that very soon a very nice, hardly used, Stronglight Made in France 56T - 130 BCD chainring will appear in the sales thread.

 

[JKL]

Long time no photo!

Anhang anzeigen 277658

Aua ... mach doch wenigstens Schrumpfschlauch drum ...

 

[anotherkiwi]

Yes, yes don't worry! The crimp on contacts are too big so I need to redo those and at the same time some insulation will be added.

 

[anotherkiwi]

A factor I have neglected to mention in the chain tension problem posts: my rear suspension lockout is not working - a loss of oil I think.

I suspect that with a fully functional lockout on the rear I would not have experienced such a great loss of power... So the first step will be to repair the remote lockout and see what that brings.

 

[anotherkiwi]

As I suspected the remote lockout is not working so I will need to bleed/recharge with oil. There is a U shaped clip in the remote and it has come loose, the hydraulic hose just dropped out of the control lever and no oil came out I don't think that is a good sign.

Questions:

- can I just do this via the remote?
- do I have to access the damper as well?

I have no experience with MTB dampers and hydraulics in general.